Hi,
This is a naive series of clarification questions, but I'd just like to confirm that I understand a few practical things about pTFCE, seeing as there is also a bit of variation in published articles that have used (p)TFCE with some articles reporting along the lines of, "p < 0.005 pTFCE corrected" while others, "p < 0.05, FWER corrected, pTFCE".
1a). Would it be a reasonable way to think about pTFCE as addressing the problem of over-inflated p's due to multiple comparisons (without applying FDR or FWE) -- and therefore, we can very well say "p < 0.005 pTFCE corrected"? I thought TFCE was actually an alternative to cluster-extent based approach to deal with multiple comparisons -- with AFNI's AlphaSim, we would usually report along the lines of "p<0.001 uncorr. voxelwise, corrected at p<0.05 on cluster size" -- so wouldn't applying FDR and FWER on top of pTFCE be overkill? When would you do pTFCE and FDR or FWE?
1b). Any rules of thumb/things to keep in mind/pitfalls to avoid for choosing the threshold level of pTFCE-enhanced images when not using FWE/FDER as well?
According to the Wiki on ptfce.r, "In general, it is valid to threshold your enhanced Z-score image with the same Z-score threshold you would have applied for the original (unenhanced) Z-score image. E.g. you can threshold the enhanced Z-score image for an uncorrected p<0.001 with the corresponding Z-score value of Z>3.1." -- what I read in this snippet is that not applying FDR/FWE on top of pTFCE is methodologically okay as long as we choose a threshold that is low enough. (In my case, it seems like a threshold of p<0.001 in the "p_uncorr" column in the "peak" section of the SPM results table may still not be low enough -- I have quite a few 1-vx activations in my pTFCE-enhanced image, which does not instill much confidence in me. However, looking at FDR/FWE (if I were to just read it straight off the SPM results table of the pTFCE-enhanced stat map) seems overly conservative.
2). To apply FDR or FWER, is it just a matter of reading off p_FWE-corr and q_FDR-corr in the "peak-level" section of the SPM results table of the pTFCE-enhanced contrasts?
In the 2019 NeuroImage paper, "pTFCE_vox" is decribed as "T-score maps...converted to Z-score maps, fed into the pTFCE algorithm and thresholded based on GRF theory, with a corrected threshold of p < 0.05" -- would this correspond to p<0.05 in the "p_FWE_corr" column in the SPM results table of the pTFCE-enhanced stat image?
On the Wiki for the SPM-toolbox version of pTFCE, it does say that the stats in the "peak-level" section of the SPM results table is correct (and just to ignore the "cluster-level" section). Is this because the FDR/FWE q/p values are based on the original stat map? Because otherwise it would seem to contradict the ptfce.r Wiki which says:
"Never use the enhanced Z-score map as an input for GRF-based multiple correction techniques. Instead, use the original Z-score map to compute the Z-score threshold and then use this threshold on the enhanced image."
3). On the Wiki for ptfce.r, should the following passage:
"Never use voxel-level thresholding on the pTFCE-enhanced image. It already incorporates the cluster information, thus thresholding it based on cluster-extent (of the original image) would be double-dipping."
actually say "Never use cluster-level thresholding on the pTFCE-enhanced image" ?
Thank you very much for your help (and for the toolbox!)!
Gina